Read more here -> Google troubed by new Internet rules in Vietnam – AFP

I guess I do not want to state the obvious here but for the last 6 years, certain websites in Vietnam have ALREADY been blocked.  Yahoo Geocities sites were blocked in the past; Facebook with FPT and EVN are currently blocked; many human right’s sites are already blocked.  Even my blog is blocked with certain ISPs.  No news here…

Furthermore, the government can already track the online activities of internet users.  To register for an internet line, you either have to present your Vietnamese ID or passport if you are a foreigner.

I am guessing the new regulations are just trying to stop people from using OpenVPN, OpenDNS or Google Public DNS.  That is just a guess of course…

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It is all done!!!

Now I will try to get my Vietnamese driver’s license for both a car and motorbike.  That is supposed to be much easier.  I will start that process myself on Monday.

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My school is now working on getting me my 3 year temporary resident card.

Yes, it was a bit difficult to get my work permit.  I originally started with my company, SLG Vscapeone.  Due to problems related to my ex-business partner, the documents filled out for the Department of Labour, Invalids and Social Affairs (DoLISA) were incorrectly filled out.  One document listed me as General Director, the other as Assistant Manager.  Yes, this was purposely done and many know I was forced to leave Vietnam for 4 days to fix my visa in Phnom Penh, Cambodia, last March.  Now everything is good to go and I hope many Expats do not have to experience the headache I went through.

So here is my recap on how “Americans” can get their work permits.  There are still many who need to obtain them before the July deadline at which point Vietnam will start to deport those foreigners who do not hold work permits.

Rule #1, DO NOT USE AN AGENT to get your work permit.  They are worthless and not worth the time and money you will spend with them.  I used my ex-business partner’s friend who, for nearly 5 months, did nothing to help me obtain my work permit though I had to pay him.  When Horizon resubmitted the forms, we had to start from scratch (minus the police report and health check).  My lawyer filled out my job experience form.  Skip the agent, ask your employers or very close friend to help you.  You have to do most of the work anyway.

Here we go:

1.  Diploma: First thing first, get your university diploma (DoLISA only needs the latest one) notarized in the US.  Contact your university and tell them that you need a copy of your diploma notarized.  Indiana University required me to FedEx my original master’s diploma to them ($48 US) to start the process.  Be sure to tell them that Vietnam is not a member of the Hague Convention so it does not recognize the apostille.  This is very important.

For me, the process started after IU got my diploma.  It first went to Monroe County for an apostille ($1 US).  The apostille here is okay since you need the notarized stamp from the state-level, not the county-level.  From there a registered notary republic at IU notarized my diploma (Free) and then sent it to the Secretary of State for Indiana.  This took a couple days but in the end, you should have a Gold State Seal on your document with the country apostille and a notarized stamp.

From there, have the Secretary of State’s office FedEx your document to a relative or friend in the US ($30 US).  Then they will FedEx it to the Department of State for authentication ($8).  Go to this website to fill out the form: http://www.state.gov/m/a/auth/ Be sure to include a ‘domestic’ FedEx airbill so it can be sent back to you.  For me, it took less than 5 business days to process but unfortunately now, it takes 25 business days.  Once they authenticate the notarized stamp, they will append a tan document with Madam  Secretary Hilary Clinton’s signature with a gold ring.  They then will FedEx this back to you (if you included the airbill – $30 US).

Now the last part is to FedEx the document to the Vietnam Embassy in Washington, DC.  This time include an international FedEx airbill with an address to Vietnam ($48).  Make a check out for Vietnam Embassy and send it to the following address:

Embassy of Vietnam
1233 20th St NW, Suite 400 – Washington, DC 20036

It was cost $50 US to legalize your diploma and another $20 US to expedite it.  It took only one day for me to get the legalized stamp at the Embassy and then they FedEx the document back to my school in Vietnam.

Once you get the legalized document, it will need to be translated into Vietnamese by an authorized translator.  When they are done, the translated diploma will be submitted you can keep your diploma.  The translated diploma is good for six months.

2.  Criminal Background Check:  If you have been in Vietnam for less than 6 months, you will need to get a criminal background check from the US.  This will need to be authenticated and legalized as above but I am not sure if it will be double the price.

For those who have been in Vietnam for over 6 months, you can just do it here.  Just ask your landlord where you lived for six months (should be in one house) to give you the housebook.  You then will take this to the Judiciary Department on Pasteur street.  They will have you fill out some forms there.  They are very helpful so if you do not have an interpretor, you should be okay.  After you submit and pay for the fee (I think about 100,000 VND), they will give you a receipt which tells you when to return to pick up your background check.

3.  Health Check: You can do this at Cho Ray, Columbia Asia, or Family Medical Practice.  I think it was about $40 US but I forgot.  They will know what to do.  You can pick the results the next day and they are good for 6 months.

4.  The Rest:  Your employer will help you translate your resume into Vietnamese based on DoLISA’s guidelines.  They will also fill out two more forms stating your Job Title and duties with their company.  You will need to submit 4-5 passport pictures as well.  They will also need an ‘official’ copy of your passport and visa.

It took 20 business days for me to get my work permit and the forms were submitted to DoLISA.  Overall, I paid nearly $700 US for my work permit process but it should only cost around $350-400 US if you do it by yourself.   Much cheaper if you are in the US.

My lawyer was very helpful in this matter after the “agent” really messed up things.  HIBS was the lifesaver in getting my work permit processed in the end but I give a lot of credit to my lawyer who helped me figure out how to finally authenticate and legalize my diploma.  Even DoLISA was helpful back in March in explaining the process.

For now, if you needed to start your work permit process FROM Vietnam, it should take about 2-3 months.

Best of luck to those seeking work permits in Vietnam.  Email me if you need any help.  Again, avoid the agents, they just cost needless money…

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The time period to obtain your work permit can exceed 6 months for some.  Getting the necessary authentications are not that easy and for some Expats, they will need to wait at least 6 months before they can even submit the work permit application (you need to wait 6 months before you can do your criminal background check in Vietnam.  It is not realistic to have it done overseas since many Expats live in more than one location over the last 10 years).

Luckily for many Expats, due to the lack of transparency of Vietnamese government agencies, this ruling will be hard to implement.  It could also jeopardize the steady stream of new ‘legitimate’ revenue for the Ministry of Foreign Affairs with the increase visa fees for many Expats and Tourists.  This will be a wait and see thing…

Foreign workers in Vietnam will have to obtain a work permit by July or they will be deported, according to a new regulation drafted by the Ministry of Labor, War Invalids and Social Affairs (MoLISA).

Foreigners working in Vietnam for more than three months without a permit will not have their visas or their temporary residence cards extended, according to the draft.

In many cases, they will be deported, the draft said.

Six months after the draft takes effect this July, all foreign workers that have not applied for a work permit will be sent home.

Those foreigners hired to manage or operate production lines must have at least five years experience in management jobs to hold such positions here, according to the draft.

Also, foreigners working in Vietnam must be over 18 years old and have clean criminal records.

Vietnam’s current decree on foreign labor only includes the conditions by which to grant work permits to foreigners, not punishment for those without them, Le Quang Trung, deputy head of the MoLISA’s Job Department, was quoted by the Vietnam Economic Times as saying recently.

“The new decree gives authorities the foundation and rights on which to expel foreign workers,” Trung said.

Firms will be fined VND5-10 million (US$268-535) if their foreign employees don’t meet the requirements.

The amendments also require Vietnamese employers, especially construction firms and project investors, to keep local authorities updated with their foreign worker statistics.

City and provincial labor departments will receive applications for work permits.

Foreigners will not need the permit if they are members of limited firms that have two or more members, owners of one-member limited firms, board members of joint stock firms, promoters of specific services, and lawyers that are allowed by the Ministry of Justice to work in Vietnam.

The work permit will be effective for up to three years, depending on the terms of each worker’s labor contract. Foreigners can have their permit extended if their work requires more than three years or if they’re supposed to transfer technology to Vietnamese workers and need more time to do so, the draft said.

Official statistics showed that Vietnam now employs nearly 60,000 legal foreign workers and 20,000 illegal ones, many of them manual workers. Vietnam’s policy is to export manual workers and receive none.

Figures from the Ministry of Public Security last year showed that more than 35,000 Chinese were working in Vietnam.

Source: http://www.thanhniennews.com/2010/Pages/20100329113212.aspx

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Visit How to get a 5 year visa exemption for more information.

Having this type of visa means you will have to leave Vietnam every three months (border run to Moc Bai) but I heard some Viet Kieu are able to renew it in Saigon for a “fee”.

For the rest of us, once you have renewed your 3 month visas three times (for 9 months), you will have to leave Vietnam to renew your visa.  The easiest is getting a “letter of invitation” from you company or school, especially for Americans.  The other option is to go through the tedious work permit process which, once approved, allows you to obtain a 2-3 year temporary resident card.

The choice is yours…

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Essentially, a consularized degree is when you get a document notarized by a ‘recognized’ government body in your country.  In the US, this usually means there is a notarized stamp and a gold seal on the document.  According to Vietnamese law, you can take this to the US Consulate, or your embassy of choice, attach an affidavit certifying it is a true copy and then submit it to the Ministry of Foreign Affairs  (MFA).  Note, the affidavit will say, in bold letters, that the US Consulate will not accept responsibility for the document.  The MFA ‘will’ accept this document, translate it, attach another seal and it is “legal” but because of the previous statement from the US Consulate, DoLISA will not accept it.

Hence you are left no choice but to authenticate your diploma.  In short you must:

1. Get your university to notarize your degree, it cannot be an apostille (electronic seal) since Vietnam is not a member of the Hague convention.  The notarization process will start at the County-level (about $1 per document in Indiana) and then to the Secretary of State level (free).  Be sure to include a FedEx airbill and envelope.  This process can take about 5-7 business days depending on your state.  One to two days if you hand carry it.  You will need to send a personal check to pay for the fees.
2. The “notarized” degree will then need to be sent to the US Department of State in Washington, DC.  This costs about $8 per document.  The process takes 5-8 business days.  You can find more information at this web address: http://www.state.gov/m/a/auth/.  Many people skip this process but legally, you MUST get your diploma authenticated by the US State Sept. for it to be legal.  In the future, DoLISA “could” refuse diplomas that were not authenticated here even IF the Vietnam Embassy or Consulate legalizes them.  You can send a personal check to pay the fees.
3. Finally you must send your diploma to either the Vietnam Embassy or Consulate.  Today the Embassy told me it will cost about $50 to “legalize” the diploma and $20 to expedite it.  Just mail them to the Vietnam Embassy, 1233 20^th St NW, suite 400, Washington DC 20036, or Consulate, Suite 430, 1700 California, San Francisco, California.  Be sure to include a FedEx airbill and envelope so they can return it to you when completed.  The Vietnam Embassy recommends you keep the tracking number as well.  I will send a money order since both the Embassy and Consulate will not accept personal checks I am told.  I heard this process takes about 7 business days but if you expedite it, it should be faster.

Thus, the whole authenticating process, including shipping time, is roughly 3-4 weeks if you live in Vietnam.  It is actually not as painful as I thought.  Just time consuming the first time around (yes, you will have to do this again yearly since the validity of the legalized diploma is about 6 months).  Vietnamese who studied overseas will have to go through the same authentication process in the near future as well.  Some Vietnamese companies are noticing an increasing number of Vietnamese “claiming” they studied an earned a degree when they did not (this happens in Vietnam as well).

A final note, I do not recommend using a service to handle your work permit.  They CANNOT do anything special for you.  In fact, from experience, you will have to be with your service agent throughout the process so essentially you are just paying a “high” fee to have somebody walk with you.  Just find a friend or trust your HR manager to take care of the process.  It is cheaper this way in the long run.  If you need help, then use a “trusted” Vietnamese lawyer for “advice” only.

As of now, my diploma is in Wash., DC, getting authenticated.  I hope to send it to the Vietnamese Consulate later next week but my process is almost over.

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From there, the service agent’s assistant will get it translated.  All English forms have to be translated into Vietnamese for obvious reasons by an authorized translator.  I am not sure where they are going but if you need your documents translated, I recommend the Hanoi Translation Company on the corner of Pasteur and and Nguyen Du in District 1.  Ask for Mr. Quoc.  He can also help process work permits (5 million VND), visas and temporary resident cards.  I should have used him for my work permit processing in the beginning but I do use him for my visa renewals.

For me, I told the service I want to see the forms after they are translated and properly stamped.  I also want to visit DoLISA with them when they drop off my application so I can see that everything is okay.  According to the service, everything will be done by March 19th but that is a full two weeks later than they told me last time and a full 4 four months later than the original date they gave me.  Got to keep on them…

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Today I arrived to meet my service agent at his office at 8:45 AM for a 9 AM appointment.  He did not show up and he staffed tried repeatedly to call him.  He just disappeared.  Then his assistant called my Vietnamese friend who in turn yelled at her.  Thirty minutes later, she and I met my friend at the MFA (6 Alexandre Rhodes street in District 1).  We entered the front office where you submit your documents and my friend and I both were surprised that she, the assistant, had no idea what to do.  That is when we realized that the service agent never submitted my documents.  Remember, yesterday he told me that the MFA refused to accept my document since it was not notarized by the US Consulate.  It cost 160,000 VND to do this process, a little more if you forget to make a copy.

I submitted my forms after we made photo copies (remember to make a photocopy of your notarized degree outside the office).  I submitted my diploma and passport.  About 15 minutes later they called me up and a man gave me a form to fill up.  Yes, they do speak English.  I filled it out and gave it back to him.  About 20-30 minutes later (it was busy today so come at 9 AM if you can) he gave me the receipt which told me when to pick up my diploma.  They had accepted it.  It was that easy and finally it was consularized.

Guys, I mean Americans here, the key to getting your diploma accepted is to remember the keyword here, consularization.  I read the law here and my friend explained to me thoroughly which is why he was surprised my service agent could not do it.  The law says that before you can get it consularized, you must first have your diploma notarized by a government authority in the US.  Then after it is notarized, you then need to get an affidavit, notary or seal from the US Consulate (or Embassy).  The US Consulate in Vietnam will only give an affidavit.  After you get this, then you will take it to the MFA to get it consularized.  Remember, the Vietnamese government consularizes it, not the US Consulate.

So in short, to get my diploma recognized, I first FedEx’d it to Indiana University.  From there, Indiana University made two copies (you should make 10 if you can), sent it to Monroe County to start the process, then notarized it and sent it to the Secretary of State of Indiana.  The Secretary of State then added their Gold Seal sticker to all of the original and copies and FedEx’d it back to me (be sure to include a completed bill form so they can send it back).  This process took me 3 weeks total.  It would have been shorter but the US was experiencing the holidays at that time.  Total cost here was about $90 US which included two FedEx fees and about $6 US for Monroe County.

When I received my notarized documents, I took the original diploma and one notarized diploma to the US Consulate.  They then attached a piece of paper and I had to write “I swear that this is a true copy”.  After that, one of the Consuls came and I had to raise my right hand and swear an oath.  They then signed, stamped all the documents and imprinted their seal on the documents.  This costs about $35 US (plus a credit card fee of $35 US for me).  From there I just needed to take these documents to the MFA and after two days, I could have picked them up.

My service agent did not do this.  He just held on to them.  I could have had my work permit before Tet if he had down his job. It turns out that many law firms do this on purpose.  Foreigners give them a deposit, 5 million VND in my case, and then give excuses that seem real to their clients but actually never do the work.  In the end, they keep the deposits since it is not their fault you DO NOT qualify for the work permit.

Now, Thursday I will pick up my translated documents from the MFA and I will submit the rest of my documents (criminal background check, CV, notarized diploma, health check, etc.) to the Department of Labor and Invalids.  Within 7 working days I should have my work permit if there are no issues with my documents.

Lastly, you do not need to use a service to get your work permit.  In fact, each time I had to go with the service agent’s assistants to get my documents.  Technically I am just paying them to accompany me.  If you do need an agent, the one who advised us today said to not pay more than 5 million VND.  He also said, do not use a law firm, they cannot be trusted.

At the MFA, I met two Americans whose diplomas were turned down.  The MFA said they needed the original copy with them which they did not have in Vietnam.  They just had copies.

So in conclusion, today in one way was a successful day for me.  I jumped the biggest hurdle.  The next one will be Thursday when I drop all my documents off.  If they give me a receipt, then I know I will get my work permit.

Oh the things you must do to stay in Vietnam…

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This happened last December when I found out that my diploma was not recognized as well.  The service agent took nearly two months before he finally told me wasting, I hate to say it, valuable time.  I told them I could get my diploma notarized in the US but they claimed it was not necessary so all the people that “helped out” convinced me it was not necessary.  Since my health was not good at the time, I let my guard down and let them continue their job since I already paid them.

Today I will go with the service agent, a close friend and another, more experienced, agent to visit the Ministry of Foreign Affairs.  The MFA’s request was not realistic and we have to tell them that.  Yesterday they told my service agent that I needed to get my diploma notarized by the US Consulate even though they know very well the US Consulate does not notarize them.  Our task is to “convince” them that my diploma is notarized, something the service agent failed to do.

If we cannot do this, the new service agent, who I used for my visas for the last couple of years, will take over.  In Vietnam, choosing the “right” agent is very, very important due to their network within the government.  Unfortunately I cannot dump my service agent now on a technicality.

In the meantime, I have to deal with the visa hassle again.  Another department of the MFA only gave me a 7 week visa which expires this Sunday.  The MFA told me I needed a work permit or that I had to leave.  Of course, due to a lack of transparency, there is no computer system they can use to see whether I was processing my work permit application or not.

Yeah, a lot of frustration.  Many Americans I know are having the same exact problem.  One thing is certain, if the US Consulate would just notarize our diplomas, or notarize the notarized diplomas, the US citizens in Vietnam would not be having so much trouble.  I did an affidavit of a notarized diploma which does not seem to work at the moment even though the Vietnamese law says it is legal.

Lets see what happens today…

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Today, my local ward police signed two documents stating that I lived in my house over 6 months.  I will need this form before the Judiciary Department would start my criminal background check.  Normally you needed to provide copies of your housebook but we were told to get this documents as well so it could speed up the background check process.

Getting the necessary documents from my ward police was not easy.  Since they never processed this request before, they asked us to create the document ourselves.  Our first document, submitted by my landlord, was not approved.  With their help, I edited the form, with the help of my Vietnamese IT students, with their inputs and submitted this form to the ward police yesterday afternoon.  Before they would sign it, though, they wanted me to submit to them a labor contract from my company.  I provided this today and they signed and stamped my document.  It will be submitted with my criminal background check application by the end of this week.

In retrospect, if I had the original housebook, the process would have gone faster but the landlord, mistakenly, took it home with him.  My landlord also provided another form which was supposed to convince the ward police to sign the documents.  They just made a copy of it and gave me the original.

I did not pay a thing for these documents.  The ward police were very helpful to me.  I gave about one and a half hours of my time but if I had the housebook and my labor contract, it could have been completed in 30 minutes.

Now to get my criminal background check.  Next week I will get my health check.  When my criminal background check is complete, all the paperwork will be submitted in roughly 1-2 weeks.  A service I am using will get my university degrees notarized in Vietnam since I actually have the originals here.  The whole procedure should be completed in 2 months.

The process is not painful, yes a bit of a hassle, but still doable.  Anyway, I have no choice if I want to remain and work in Vietnam.

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